zz: "Your ZigZag comments

[Ted Nelson <ted@xxxxxxxxxx>]

Hi--

I greatly appreciate your encouragement.

Interesting that I mislaid your note until it became especially
 relevant.

>Imagine an N-dimensional-matrix-based programming language, consistent
with Zigzag's N-dimensional interface structure. Such a beast would be
*very* useful for Zigzag: It might let Zigzag be programmed in Zigzag,
turning Zigzag from 'merely' a possible killer user interface/environment,
into a possible killer programming language/environment. 

You've described my current thinking.

However, "tables" in the conventional world (eg spreadsheet)
 are pre-allocated and rectangular, with several annoying
 constraints.  ZZspace (sorry it's not on Web yet) has a number
 of interesting properties, including--
Row-and-column visibility BUT
? There are no empty cells; unoccupied columns aren't in the row
? Each row can be in any order
? Any number of cells can be at any intersection (!)

These paradoxical properties will be usable for a lot of things,
 INCLUDING specification of arguments into a program
 and results out.

All best, Ted



>Consistency and coherence are very powerful.

That's my emphasis.








You wrote: =====================================

>From: Ted Nelson <ted@xxxxxxxxxx>
>
>Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:44:22 -0800
>From: Jerry Fass <fass@xxxxxxxxxx>
>Reply-To: fass@xxxxxxxxxx
>X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04GoldC-KIT  (Win16; I)
>To: Ted Nelson <ted@xxxxxxxxxx>, ted@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>Subject: TOP for Zigzag?
>
>Kon-nichi wa Oh Great and Noble Cyber-Prophet, from Milwaukee, Wisconsin,
a large-ish northern suburb of Chicago IL.
>
>I am your humble servant, in a trivial way, though you do not know me. I
have considered writing you before, but didn't, as I had nothing to add to
your efforts, and didn't want to waste your time. Now, I may have a worthy
gift.
>
>First, a bit of history (I treat you in 3rd person as I may reuse this
text): I first heard of Ted Nelson in about 1986/87 via 2 books. Eric
Drexler's "Engines of Creation" lead me to Howard Rhiengold's "Tools for
Thought". I then sought out Ted Nelson's "Computer Lib / Dream Machines".
But horror of horrors, there was not even 1 copy of the book, in all
Southeast Wisconsin, as far as I could tell, and *the* copy in Madison was
out for months (University copy). I was desperate, as this seemed to be a
key work.
>
>Fortunately I was friendly with the head librarian at my local Milwaukee
Public Library, East branch, so I lobbied him to order the book, praising
it vociferously. He got it! Thus, yes indeed, *I* am the guy who got the
first copy of "Computer Lib" into the SE Wisconsin Library system! (No
doubt you've lain awake nights tormented by this very question.) I devoured
"Computer Lib" and still take it out every several years (though with all
due respect, nay reverence, you may count me among those poor souls who are
uncomfortable with the flip-and rotate). I couldn't wait to get my hands on
my own copy of Personal Xanadu. But, alas, my hunger went unsated.
>
>I first read of Zigzag in summer 1998, at a library, in some
periodical(?), but the details were tantalizingly sparse, mere hints.
"Cool" I thought, "He's still at it!" I searched for Zigzag a few times on
the Web last summer and fall, but with no success, for whatever reason.
Some 18 hours ago I was sitting before my screen, and felt the urge to read
something not my norm, so I went to google.com, and thought for a minute.
Then I remembered Zigzag, and typed it in. Within minutes, I had finally
found a good Zigzag article (Wearable Computer Conference) with enough
details to start to see the point.
>
>Wow!
>
>This might go somewhere! This is really exciting!
>
>OK, here's the gift:
>
>On reading the Zigzag article, I recalled something interesting, even
exciting, and very resonant, that I read a few months ago. The more I think
of it, the more fascinating the possibility seems.
>
>http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lab/6888/top.htm
>TOP: Table Oriented Programming
>
>Brief description:
>Programming that puts tables first. Tables are a vital data representation
method. In some applications they are central, almost all you need; far
superior to standard APIs.
>
>The Connection; How TOP may relate to Zigzag:
>Imagine an N-dimensional-matrix-based programming language, consistent
with Zigzag's N-dimensional interface structure. Such a beast would be
*very* useful for Zigzag: It might let Zigzag be programmed in Zigzag,
turning Zigzag from 'merely' a possible killer user interface/environment,
into a possible killer programming language/environment. Consistency and
coherence are very powerful.
>
>I hope this helps, somehow.
>
>Thank you for everything you have done, and will do. You don't deserve all
the bad that has befallen you over the years. You deserve a big success.
>
>If you wish to email me on this, I will be grateful, but I know you are
most busy.
>
>Seyonara Amigo!

____________________________________________________
Theodor Holm Nelson, Project Professor,
 Keio University SFC Campus, Fujisawa, Japan
 Home Fax from USA: 011-81-466-46-7368  (If in Japan, 0466-46-7368)
http://www.sfc.keio.ac.jp/~ted/  (Professorial page)
_____________________________________________________
Permanent: Project Xanadu, 3020 Bridgeway #295, Sausalito CA 94965
 Tel. 415/ 331-4422, fax 415/332-0136  
http://www.xanadu.net (see also Professorial page, above)
PERMANENT E-MAIL: ted@xxxxxxxxxx
_____________________________________________________
Quotation of the Day, 99.05.14
Slow movement often looks as if it is in the opposite direction.  TN99